Conservatives? What Conservatives?
It is never a pleasant thing to critique those who are supposed to be on your own side. I don’t really relish asking hard questions of, and offering critical commentary on, those who are supposed to be on my team – at least my same ideological and political team.
But when your team seems to walk and talk pretty much like the other team, then some probing questions and some constructive criticism is certainly necessary. I refer to the scene here in Australia, and the fact that we have a federal election in just over two weeks.
I am fully aware that probably 98 per cent of all politicians will normally – even routinely – put political expediency ahead of primary principles. Most have as their number one goal simply to get elected – or re-elected. Thus they tend to say and do whatever is necessary to get to have that happen.
Sadly our so-called conservative politicians can be as guilty of this as the leftist ones. The Liberal Party is supposed to be – at least to a certain extent – Australia’s conservative party. But far too often it seems to be anything but. Far too often its leaders and most of its team seem to be little more than Labor-lite.
The things that concern many real conservatives and Christians are often ignored, played down, or even spoken against. And this bothers so many of us. As should be clear by now, I happen to be a conservative, but I am a Christian first. So I see the crucial importance of biblical values and principles as I assess political and ideological parties and positions.
But even leaving aside my Christian concerns, I see many worrying signs in the Libs. Some major issues that all conservatives should rightly be concerned about are repeatedly dismissed by the Liberals. And two of the bigger ones – the ongoing war on marriage, family and children, and the slow but steady elevation of sharia law in Australia – seem to be nowhere on the Liberal’s radar.
And we had the perfect example of this over the past few days. Several Liberal candidates were disendorsed by the Libs, or forced to step down. Why? Were they found out to have been child rapists years ago? Were they found to have a long record of armed robberies?
No, something much worse it seems. One actually made some comments years ago about stealth jihad and creeping sharia, while another asked if the radical homosexual agenda was in the best interests of Australian society. Because of these comments being made over the years – including some on my own site – they were promptly given the flick by the Liberal head honchos.
All the media has been abuzz with stories concerning this over the past few days. Here is part of just one of many reports on this:
A Victorian Liberal candidate has resigned after being embroiled in an extremism row, publicly endorsing an attack on his party colleague, Goldstein MP Tim Wilson, as a “notorious homosexual”. Peter Killin complained to fellow right-wing Liberal Christian activists in December that not enough of them had shown up at a preselection vote for the Liberal heartland seat of Goldstein in 2016 to prevent Mr Wilson from being selected to represent the seat. Mr Killin, who was contesting the Labor-held seat of Wills in Melbourne’s inner north, made his remarks in the comments thread of the blog of Christian-right blogger Bill Muehlenberg. The party confirmed Mr Killin’s resignation on Wednesday afternoon.
Hmm, that Killin guy must be one really evil dude. And that Muehlenberg character is obviously beyond the pale. String ‘em both up! Several candidates have now been given the boot, not just for making some rather mild comments on my site, but on other sites as well.
For daring to think what many concerned Australians think, the Liberal Party decided that they could not be one of them. They were just too toxic. We already know that Labor and the Greens would not want them – but the Libs as well? Really? Is this Party now so hyper-PC that anyone who dares to say anything about some of the biggest concerns of our time must be excluded?
My advice to some of these ex-candidates is this: if your very legitimate and reasonable concerns are so detested by the Libs, then why in the world even bother running as a candidate for them? If their views differ barely at all from Labor on these sorts of topics, then why not find a genuine conservative party that DOES represent your values and concerns? Why waste time with these guys if they just want to please everyone and upset nobody?
But it is not just supposedly conservative political parties doing all this. Almost all of Australia’s ‘conservative’ commentators think exactly the same way it seems. The weekly evening run of shows on the Sky News television network is meant to be more or less conservative – sort of the Australian equivalent of Fox News in America.
Well, if last night’s viewing was anything to go on, you can forget about pretending that they are real conservatives. Not even close. Every single one of these so-called conservatives sided with the Libs against these dumped candidates. Not one of them sought to defend them or their concerns. They all washed their hands of them and repeated the lame leftist mantra that they were ‘extremists’ and unrepresentative of conservative values, etc.
Whether it was Andrew Bolt or Paul Murray or a dozen others last night, they all sanctimoniously threw these conservative candidates under the bus. Good grief – give me a break. And one of the most appalling cases of this came from Queensland commentator Daisy Cousens.
Not only did she also quickly condemn the two deposed conservatives, but she actually defended the Labor candidate who had earlier made jokes about rape! I kid you not. She happily defended the sleaze-ball Labor guy (‘oh, it was long ago and no big deal’) while turning on her own people.
Hmm, I don’t think conservative means what these people think it means. And that is just the problem we face in Australia. Sadly most high-profiles conservatives here tend to be secular, and/or libertarian, and/or simply fiscal conservatives.
Thus they are good on some issues: they dislike big government; they support the free market; they are worried about the left’s open border policies; they don’t like identity politics; they are sceptical of the climate zealots; and so on. But on so many crucial issues that so many conservatives and Christians care about deeply, such as the radical homosexual agenda, the war on the unborn, and the Islamisation of the West, most of these folks simply don’t give a rip.
Or, they refuse to speak out about them. You almost never hear them warning about the radical homosexual agenda. You almost never hear them opposing the slaughter of 80-100,000 babies a year. They are either too cowardly to speak out on these things, or they are too libertarian and too anti-Christian to care.
By way of contrast, Fox News in America regularly champions Christian concerns, and regularly stands up against baby-killing and the like. Sure, Fox has atheists and homosexuals among its presenters and commentators, but there are quite a few outspoken and devout born-again Christians who are happy to share their faith and Christian values on the shows.
Yes, America is still much more Christian than Australia is, and Australia is very secular for the most part. But still, a slim majority identify as being Christians here, and many would be concerned about the sorts of things the two dropped candidates stood for.
But they will not get a run with our so-called conservative political party or our so-called conservative commentariat. So it is hard to get genuine conservative values and beliefs being represented here in Australia. No wonder we keep getting so many new, small splinter political parties being formed to represent conservative and Christian values.
Those values sure get very little hearing with the Liberal Party for the most part. And their concerns get very little air time with the conservative commentators we have. So it is frustrating indeed, especially when each new election comes around.
So many Australians just do not like the major parties any more, and are looking for some real alternatives. Many smaller alternatives are around, with some being better than others. But until the Libs start representing us instead of ignoring us, their fortunes will likely continue to decline.
And it may already be time to find an alternative to the evening Sky News team. They are good in some areas, but appalling in others. It is time for a change.
Some of you know that one of my main means of communicating truth in the public arena has once again been stripped away from me. I am in yet another 30-day prison sentence from the tolerant and diversity-loving folks at Facebook.
They not only managed to find something I had said many weeks earlier to serve as an excuse for sin-binning me once again, but they so very conveniently made sure I would be imprisoned throughout the entire Australian election period. I will not be released until the election is over.
How convenient indeed FB! So I must rely on you, my readers, to share some of these posts for me on FB. That would be greatly appreciated if you can help me out in this manner. Simply use the FB share button found beneath each of my CW articles thanks.
And I did find it rather amusing that as FB seeks to shut me down and limit my public influence, countless newspapers in Australia yesterday were mentioning me and CultureWatch anyway. I did get a chuckle out of that one!
58 Replies to “Conservatives? What Conservatives?”
My Nana was a Christian all her life. She had a bookmark with something written on it. It said “If you were accused of being a Christian would there be enough evidence to convict you?” I wonder how many people would have enough evidence to convict them.
Greetings Bill, I would be happy to share your article on FB but I am no longer on it. Tried it once for a few months & didn’t feel good about it so got off. It’s bad karma for FB to come against God’s anointed and that you are. Bad karma has a way of boomeranging.
All the evil Australia and America are now facing is from good church people never speaking out against evil. Apostasy, I think the word is describing silence on evil. We always pray for you on our Wed. evening prayer for America. I’m always telling the Lord, “We need more Bill Muehlenberg’s in this world.” We do a lot of repenting for sins of silence.
“In Heavenly Armour we enter the Land.”
Bountiful Blessings on you and your family.
I pray some day soon
to be as bold as you.
He & I are working on that. Louise : )
Thanks Bill for exposing the Sky presenters’ behaviour last night (I hadn’t seen it). Just confirms again that following ‘conservative’ principles doesn’t necessarily equate to following Christ and His principles.
Your article is fascinating and useful in other ways too, e.g. now we know further about your cryptically referring a few days ago to would-be politicians asking you to delete earlier comments they’d contributed to your site. But a fat lot of good it did them, didn’t it, trying to subsequently conceal their real profile?!
In contrast, I praise God for the (very few) Australian political candidates/parties willing to acknowledge Christ front-and-centre in their campaign material, even though recent electoral history shows their expected best tally of first preference votes is likely only going to be a few percent. Good on them for trying, anyway.
Like I said before, Liberal Party fired Peter Killin, who is friend of this blog, as a candidate for saying basically what Israel Folau said.
The Libtards weren’t happy just with that. They then applied the thumbscrews and made Peter say “My comments were wrong and I apologise unreservedly for making them.”
That is exactly what Rugby Australia is trying to make Izzy Folau do. Forcing him to publicly repudiate his Christian biblical beliefs!
Where is the outrage from Alan Jones and Andrew Bolt and all the others who defended Izzy?
Are you implying, Michae Taouk, that Peter Killin was lying when he said that his comments were wrong? If he is lying, then he is a coward. Is the kind of person that conservatives admire?
Thanks guys. But some of you need to ease up a bit thanks. This post was on the Libs and the ‘conservative’ commentators who have let us down, throwing good candidates under the bus. I am not interested in seeing folks here picking on these men. They had the concern and the guts to at least stand for office, which is much more than most of their critics have done. So they deserve some credit, especially given the shabby treatment they have received. So no more attacks or discussion on these individuals thanks.
For some reason I didn’t know we could share these posts on Facebook, now that I know we can, I will most definitely share, it will give me much pleasure to do so.
Quote by Brother Andrew: “One man with God is a majority.”
Arguably, the essential quality for any politician or political party wanting the conservative Christian vote in the upcoming Federal election is to have a demonstrated ability to withstand externally applied pressure (assuming that the correct policies tick the correct boxes).
The one serving politician and political party that appears at this time to stand head and shoulders above the other contenders in these regards so far is the Fraser Anning’s National Conservative Party for reasons outlined in an earlier post in the 5th comment at:
Fraser Anning has had very widespread hostile mainstream media coverage, which has been known in some circumstances to have the reverse intended effect of promoting the target (as was the case with Pauline Hanson in 1996).
Whether the Fraser Anning’s National Conservative Party has sufficient electoral support to elect senators and influence lower house seats remains to be seen.
Oh dear Bill, I didn’t know you were the “Christian Right”, I’d better not be seen associating with you.
I would say we are Christians (and) Right, ie correct and truthful as we follow the example of the only One worthy to rule us, the King of Kings.
I have been guilty of referring to “Christians and Conservatives” when discussing those who believe as we do politically. However, I rather think that if we truly serve the Lord we should be radicals, not conservatives.
The Liberal Party, yes, what a disappointment, just think, while Labor and Greens certainly represent all that is contrary to that which Jesus taught and we believe, yet all the bad stuff has actually happened on the Liberals watch.
Here in Tassie over 20 years ago it was Tasmanian Liberals who opened the floodgates by legalising sodomy, they swallowed the lies of Rodney Croome who said “all (?) we want is to not have police looking in our bedroom windows.
It was under Liberals that marriage laws were smashed with a sham of a “plebiscite”. Also, they have allowed the abomination of gender madness, all which Turnbull said would not happen (no consequences?).
While I have been very involved in politics, even as a candidate for Fred Niles CDP in the last federal election, since the plebiscite, which knocked me for six, I have lost all confidence in Australian politicians.
I have some respect for Cory Bernadi and Lyle Shelton with AUSTRALIAN Conservatives. But will they disappoint us like all the others have, even the “Christian” parties that seem to come and go in this area, only to emerge near to elections.
I’m tempted to return to my earlier years when I didn’t vote for any of them.
There is one thing for sure, we as a Nation will get the government we deserve and the one God decides to gives us.
Still, heaven help us if it’s Bill Shorten.
We certainly are in a bad state.
The current election result will be crucial to see if we are in for persecution big time, or whether we will receive the reprieve we need but probably don’t deserve.
“If my people will humble themselves and pray and confess THEIR (our) sins … “.
Bill mentioned the fragmentation of parties, and that’s a real worry.
But it can be overcome if only the Christians and real conservatives would vote intelligently, especially in the Senate.
Our new Senate voting system was designed to make it hard for small parties. But small parties can beat the bias IFF they recommend preferencing ALL the other small parties with similar values. That will prevent fragmentation so that at least one will have the best possible chance of election in each State. ALSO, they need to teach voters the truth that the ONLY way to put the bad-guys last is to actually number ALL the preference boxes.
Sadly we have many well intentioned but misguided people giving Christians bad advice to number at least 6 (or 12, or half or 3/4 of the) boxes and to include a major party. The simple fact is that including a major party makes no difference: if you don’t number every box you could be failing to support a candidate who you would prefer over your worst nightmare candidate. Anybody interested in this can check out tinyurl.com/ElectoralReformOz
Graham you said “I have some respect for Cory Bernadi and Lyle Shelton with AUSTRALIAN Conservatives. But will they disappoint us like all the others have, even the “Christian” parties that seem to come and go in this area, only to emerge near to elections.”
Graham I think you are premature in judging Cory Bernadi and Lyle Shelton so early- Cory Bernardi left the Liberal Party (after 15 yrs) because of the LNP’s loss of conservative values and is now slowly trying to bring in a christian perspective and stand for conservative values that the LNP have lost. With that sort of comment you may as well give up although I can hear your frustration – but what I have found is that a large percentage of christians don’t care about getting involved in grassroots support for groups that espouse christian values. Check out their websites and see what they stand for.
The reason I recently joined the Liberal party was to bring about change but maybe it’s a little late – the frog in warm water scenario
We desperately need the likes of AUSTRALIAN CONSERVATIVES in the Senate – at least one from each state at least to keep some sort of normality and our values in the upper house and to stop this rampant march of the Left to overtake our Christian values
I cannot believe the ‘conservative’ LNP Government goes and puts the PUP party as first preference and the Katter party ( who gets part funded by Get -Up last time – not sure this time) as 3rd preference and then the real CONSERVATIVE Party (Australian Conservatives) as fourth. What does that tell you?
Remember folks you don’t have to follow the LNP’s how to vote card if you are a LNP person – if you want some value change in the Senate then vote Cory Bernardi’s team in every state and then check out the other parties of your preference. Remember to mark in box O for Aust Conservatives in the Senate.
Please people as most christian commentators are saying we are at a crossroad and your vote can make the difference.
Also if you really wanted to get involved see if you can help out with election day or pre -polling.
I went to vote this week and Labor had 8 people plus 3 union people handing out how to vote cards , 3 One Nation, 1 Green, 5 LNP’s, 1 PUP
and one Aust Conservative.
Remember YOU can make a difference – Start now and get involved.
But being a politician or a candidate would be a very difficult profession – so please pray for them
On the same day Jessica Whelan is to be disendorsed as a Liberal candidate for raising concerns about Islam, we have:
Jihadist, “planing a terror attack by planting a bomb on an international flight” – incarcerated. 
Jihadist, “found guilty of stabbing his neighbour in Sydney terror attack” – incarcerated. 
Jihadist, “trying to lure Christians to his Canberra home and threatening to kill them ” – incarcerated. 
 Meat grinder bomb plot verdict returned, one brother found guilty of planning terror attack
 Ihsas Khan found guilty of stabbing his neighbour in Sydney terror attack
 Ex-journalist arrested over threats wanted ‘reprisal for Christchurch’
We need more Jessica Whelan’s.
NOTICE TO ANY GOOGLE-SLEUTH TROLLING ‘CULTUREWATCH’ ARTICLES FOR NAMES OF PEOPLE WHO THEY INTEND TO LABEL AS ISLAMOPHOBIC OR HOMOPHOBIC
Just read the articles.
A comparison of Australia’s Christian and Islamic heritage
You would think the Liberals would recognise the hypocrisy of championing individual liberty in the market, but not in the womb.
They are undermining their own political philosophy by advocating for abortion, and criticising members of their own party for exercising their own freedoms of speech.
This is a sad state of affairs indeed. It seems like good evidence to me that these politicians don’t really understand and appreciate the office they’ve taken.
They seem uneducated on the basics of their own party philosophies, and have become more interested in ‘politics’ than in serving the country and championing the values of the people.
Perhaps their is a ‘better way’ forward from here.
Even in G.K. Chesterton’s time, few Tories were radically conservative enough to pursue what Chesterton called in Chapter 7 of his Orthodoxy “The Eternal Revolution”:
…But all conservatism is based upon the idea that if you leave things alone you leave them as they are. But you do not. If you leave a thing alone you leave it to a torrent of change. If you leave a white post alone it will soon be a black post. If you particularly want it to be white you must be always painting it again; that is, you must be always having a revolution. Briefly, if you want the old white post you must have a new white post. But this which is true even of inanimate things is in a quite special and terrible sense true of all human things. An almost unnatural vigilance is really required of the citizen because of the horrible rapidity with which human institutions grow old. It is the custom in passing romance and journalism to talk of men suffering under old tyrannies. But, as a fact, men have almost always suffered under new tyrannies; under tyrannies that had been public liberties hardly twenty years before. … Chesterton, Orthodoxy,London, 1908, p 194 [On-line at: https://archive.org/details/orthodoxy00chesuoft/page/194 ].
Wow, I find it amazing the liberal party in Aussie land is considered conservative. In the UK the liberal party did work with the conservative government for a while. I think it was before I was born or very small.
In the Uk amongst conservative minded people, I think it would be correct to say the liberal party would be below the communist party, in fact, I’m not even sure if we have a functioning liberal party in the sense they have any base. My dad said their failure was to get power, albeit shearing that power with the Conservative government for a time and it demonstrated what they were. They probably had more support being promis-ers and criticises than they had when they had brief power, that’s what my dad thinks anyway.
It’s likely your political parties are all left-leaning. I bet the closest you come to a Conservative party is in name only. The difference being what degree they are left than one another.
Conservatives, true conservatives are having a tough time since politics is a dirty business and conservatives in the main do not like getting dirty. Conservatives like to tell truths, but the truth isn’t wanted. Conservatives like to hold onto the good, but the good isn’t wanted, immorality is what is wanted. Conservatives like to promote personal responsibility, but it’s all someone else’s fault. But there biggest weakness is that they say, sorry but in a secular liberal society the last thing you must ever do is apologise, as its just another word for, yes I will bend to your will.
Thanks guys – and John M. Yep, we have yet another appalling example of the Liberal Party engaging in PC lunacy as it turns on its own:
“Jessica Whelan, who yesterday came under fire for allegedly posting anti-Muslim comments online, has been the latest candidate to be dumped by a major party.”
Jessica Whelan remains on the Lyons Electorate ballot paper. If I lived in Tasmania, I would vote ONE, for Jessica Whelan.
I have joined Australian Conservatives and am supporting them. At a booth is a shopping centre I told many about AC and as a result changed some voting preferences. It was both fun and a learning experience to talk to people and get to know our local candidates better. I have talked extensively to Nigel Frame and Justin Stringer. They are both Christians and people of integrity. Ways to support candidates is only limited by your imagination. We hosted Nigel, his lovely wife and another volunteer to lunch after a door knocking exercise. We all had great fun and learned a lot. I will also attend a pre-poll near me. It takes a short time out of my schedule but may give significant results. It is so encouraging to get to know others who believe the same way. The MSM encourages us to feel lonely and ‘on the fringe’ when the truth is the reverse.
Regarding Facebook, you may or may not be aware that an alternative is being launched to counter Facebook: http://m.startribune.com/owner-of-minnesota-glass-company-launches-facebook-alternative/508768612/?fbclid=IwAR1LvsJglKKRgyIKbfMUktnnSq2UDguqzeW7e_l3hm4NRExTxOLyPpc3fWM
Directed to John Miller, I’m not sure how many would have the time and be able to read your link. Perhaps we all should, this is after all how the government works. Producing volumes for academics and the types mentioned in Romans chapter 1 and achieving the desired result. I think we all see in action what the document/s teach. Thanks for posting I just read the first pages and one link- too much for me to read though.
Cheers Mark Bryant
The Australian newspaper is currently running a poll in Facebook. The question
“Should Rugby Australia sack Israel Folau over his social media posts?”
The poll is about to close – 21,400 have voted > Result Yes 11%, No 89%
Jessica Whelan joins those thrown under the bus by the Liberals to satisfy the media mob with the Minister for Trade (what’shisname) declaring in morning TV that Scott Morrison had taken a “strong decision”. Yep joining the beying mob of fake news peddlars (who can’t handle the truth about what Islam means for Australia) is displaying real strength according to the Libs.
Yes quite right Jack.
As Jack Brown notes, “Jessica Whelan joins those thrown under the bus by the Liberals”
Meanwhile, Luke Creasey joins those protected by the Labor Party.
The Australian reports, Labor candidate Luke Creasey, “‘joked online about watching his female friend have sex with multiple people and about her wanting someone to “roughly take her virginity”” “Bill Shorten defended Mr Creasey over his posts from 2012, saying he had apologised and therefore would remain as the party’s candidate for Melbourne”.
hypocrisy. hypocrisy. hypocrisy.
I was a huge supporter of Australian Conservatives when Cory first launched his party but supporting them has been one disappointment after another, Eg. how AC abandoned Rachel Carling-Jenkins in VIC and then in NSW how they put their best campaigner in an unwinnable position and getting only 15,000 votes maybe cause of that.
After voting AC in the NSW election I was thinking I shouldn’t wasting my vote on them again in this election. If they don’t do something different they are so far away from a “quota” people like me thinking of voting AC shouldn’t even bother.
But here is something they could do to energise their voters and get 6 senators up and maybe 3 Lower House MPes.
Cory should get in contact with our friend Peter Killin and with Jeremy Hearn and Jessica Whelan and ask them if they want to run as AC candidates. I have heard they are still on the ballot paper as Liberals and that means they will pick up lots of Liberal sheep votes and that combined with the AC votes might be enough get them elected. That’s how Pauline got elected in 1996.
All three are now very well known and they should use their high profiles to look into every camera and say they are running for AC for Freedom of Speech and Freedom for Australians to Bear Christian Witness.
Over to you Cory and Lyle. This is your opportunity. The choice is between repeating the NSW result (<15,000 votes) or winning 9 seats. Sounds like an easy choice to me!
I notice we have the ability to place preferences above the line on the senate ticket so I will probably be voting CDP, Conservative, Liberal but unless enough people join me, obviously, the preference will fall to the Liberal candidates.
Please, people, join me. We have a great system with preferential voting in Australia. It is a massive loss to not use that privilege and simply vote for a major party especially when that party’s preferences are to someone like Clive Palmer. One thing Labor is correct about is the Liberal’s obeisance to big money. That is not good democratic practice especially when that huge monetary influence is shown to be doing wrong.
Michael, if we don’t “place preferences above the line on the senate ticket”, filling in AT LEAST 6 preferences, then our vote is INFORMAL. The days of a single 1 above the line where you submit to the preferences dictated by the Party concerned are thankfully gone for Federal Senate elections (not for State elections).
But there are two things that are essential to get maximum value for your vote in aiming to 1. elect good candidates and 2. reject bad ones:
1. Make sure that your vote preferences ALL the good small Parties before going to any of the mediocre big Parties: that gives the best chance of of electing a good small Party because it helps prevent the conservative Christian vote from fragmenting.
2. The ONLY way to put a bad Party last is to number every other box – because if we don’t number EVERY box above the line, we risk failing to support a Party that we would prefer rather than a really bad Party.
I urge anyone who’s not up to date with how our complicated Senate elections work NOW (it changed a couple of elections ago) to watch the short video at https://youtu.be/bw15fhq_gDQ. The video is good, but make sure you read my comments below the video correcting a common false belief that including a major Party reduces the chance of your vote exhausting. An ‘exhausted’ vote is partly wasted: it has no say over the last Senator. Vote ‘exhaustion’ is a serious problem: 9.2% of formal votes exhausted in NSW in 2016. For more info on Senate vote counting, ‘exhaustion’, and how to get best value for your vote, see tinyurl.com/ElectoralReformOz.
Bernard Gaynor makes sense re the Israel Folau fiasco.
8 things you need to know about the Israel Folau farce
(Very good, but possibly a little too personal re Raelene Castle)
– today Alan Jones quotes Bernard Gaynor
And when we get to the tribunal stage, and affidavits are sworn, witnesses will take the stand, and, as Bernard Gaynor wrote: “Our legal system, in its zeal for the facts will allow people to swear on the Bible that what they say is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help them God … the same Bible that Israel Folau quoted from … the same Bible that Raelene Castle says is so offensive that merely quoting from it should see one cast, weeping and gnashing their teeth into the exterior darkness … the same Bible (on which) our governors-general and prime ministers take their oath of office.”
You see the problem is I don’t think there are any good parties so I think I’m going to get my name crossed off, take my ballot papers and do a donkey vote. I think a lot of Christians will do that too.
One thing that could change my vote is if Cory Bernardi and Lyle Shelton recruit Peter Killin, Jeremy Hearn and Jessica Whelan as AC candidates in the Lower House.
All the things they said that the Liberal Party doesn’t like they are things the silent majority care about.
Possibly Jessica Whelan is on to something. Adding to the above list of yesterday’s incarcerations:
Jihadist and – “leader of a group of extremist Muslims who planned a “foreign incursion” to help overthrow the government of the southern Philippines” – incarcerated. 
 Tinnie terrorist plot ringleader Robert Cerantonio jailed for seven years
Family Voice Australia, in a recent email said, amongst other things, it/they ‘had been working hard to identify pro-life Senate candidates…’
As a voter in Victoria, I received a list of 15 candidates who Family Voice ‘understand to be pro-life so they would vote against widening the availability of abortion, or against euthanasia in the territories, if elected.’ They come from seven different parties, with an eighth being an independent. It could be a good place to start.
I presume FV has done the same for the other states and the territories.
Michael, OK, hear the frustration, but if good men do nothing, that facilitates the evil parties being elected. So while many of the parties are poor or mediocre, they are preferable to the really bad ones. And if we don’t support and encourage the best we’ve got, things will get even worse.
Thanks Neil, Family Voice is being as helpful as it can and has sent me info also. While FV do lots of good things, and rightly recommend numbering every box below the line as being good, they, like many others, don’t seem to understand the dangers of voting (only) 1-12 below the line (BTL): their web article on Senate voting seems to say you’re 75% safe voting 1-12 BTL, but in reality, especially in NSW, it’s possible to vote 1-12 BTL and not have a single candidate elected – worse to not even have a say over who the last Senator will be. I’m convinced that apart from in ACT and NT the most reliable way to vote is number every box ATL because voting every box BTL is very hard work, is error prone, and is likely to make zilch difference.
We have a problem that Christian non-party organisations don’t want to be partisan in supporting a given candidate or party, but that is of little help to voters wanting guidance in how to fill out a Senate Ballot Pater with (in NSW the largest) 35 Parties ATL and 105 Candidates BTL. Fortunately we’ve managed to get agreement from many, Bill included, to support the “Traditional Family Values How To Vote Guide” that is currently attempting to rate the ~60 Parties/Groups Australia wide into Good, Fair, Mediocre, Poor & Bad support for family values so that Christian voters can intelligently make a good vote by numbering every box ATL – all without pushing any particular Party as #1.
Peter Newland, thanks for explaining about the importance of numbering every square ATL (31 in Victoria). I voted yesterday ( going overseas next week) and also used your guide that rates each party against traditional family values – and they’re in the order they appear on the ballot paper – very helpful, and far more complete in rating parties than the Australian Christian Values Checklist that is also being circulated (useful as that is). I’d mention the link but I can’t find it now. Let others know about it.
Graham and others,
The Christian Values Check Lists are at: https://www.christianvalues.org.au/index.php/checklists/current-elections
There are general, One Nation and WA versions available.
The Traditional Family Values How To Vote Guides are at
tinyurl.com/ElectoralReformOZ in the 2019FederalElectionHTVs tab – Caution: please check just before you vote because it is a work in progress.
Totally agree, Bill. Economic dries unwilling to tackle social engineering, no matter what Church they attend, and no matter what prayer meetings they attend/host, are simply causing distractions …. and not worthy of our political support. Andrews got back in Victoria despite his abhorrent social agenda because he addressed people’s daily wants: remove level crossings. Economic dries worry too much about balancing a budget, are thusly indigestible by most Aussies and leave us vulnerable to the social engineers who will spend on physical engineering to win votes.
I am going to try to vote BTL for good Christian and real conservative candidates but making it to 12 boxes is hard.
I’m in NSW and I’m going to vote  for the CDP #2 Annie Wright. (GROUP P) I could never vote for the CDP #1 Silvana Nero after reading this.
I’m going to Vote  for Sophie York (good on life and will stand up against the gender fluid agenda) and  for Riccardo Bosi from Australian Conservatives. (GROUP M)
And then I’m going to number  for Maree Nichols,  Vladimir Shigrov and  Leon Toop from Rise Up Australia. (GROUP A)
After that I have no idea.
If anyone knows good Christians to vote for BTL in NSW and can vouch for them, I would love to hard from you. No major party pollies tho (General Molan excepted).
Michael, the effectively anonymous post you linked is at least 6 years out of date because Fred Nile is not 78, but going on 85 (born September 1934), he has slept in my home but I’ve never met his second wife. Regardless of whether the post is true or not, is that relevant now? Is it a PAnS case? (Peter, Ananias & Sapphira), or is it a DUB case (David, Uriah Bathsheba)? It’s not something I’d be prepared to judge; but judging by the respect for Fred Nile from his political opponents, and even the homosexual politicians, I’d be inclined to give Silvano Nile the benefit of the doubt. I certainly don’t want to be judged for the sins of my past, and I will not try to tear down, as I could, another candidate on your list, rather we must work as co-belligerents on the same page where it counts.
But in principle I do agree with you that IFF (if and only if) there is a proven corrupt candidate standing as #1 for a Good party (which I do not accept is the case here) then we must either avoid that party totally, or vote below the line. Interestingly, iff there is a really good candidate as #3 in a major Party (e.g. Liberal #3, Antic in SA) it is NOT worth voting BTL for that candidate: instead, you can vote Liberal ATL but put them at the start of the Mediocre Parties and that actually helps all the other Good & Fair Parties, without risking wasting part of your vote electing the Lib.#1&2 by putting Libs in with the good guys, but it still gives Alex Antic (Lib.#3, SA) your support. I explain the complexities behind this in more detail in the tinyurl.com/ElectoralReformOz link, in an update, today, explaining that all the individual pro-life candidates identified by Family Voice on their website, such as Antic, are just as likely to be elected by voting for their Parties ATL, as by voting Antic BTL.
I hope and pray that the Traditional Family Values How To Vote Guides can be updated ASAP with better rating of the Parties into the Good to Bad spectrum. Delay is mainly due to the huge amount of time I’ve had to invest trying to get the movers and shakers in the Christian world to understand four simple facts:
a) to avoid fragmenting the Christian vote we must allocate preference numbers to ALL the Good & Fair parties; and then,
b) to try and keep out the really bad Parties we must also allocate preference numbers to ALL the mediocre and Poor Parties; and,
c) to achieve a) and b) we must number every box Above The Line (OK we can leave out the Bad Parties); and,
d) there’s no tangible advantage of voting BTL in 2019 except perhaps in ACT & NT.
If the Christian movers and shakers who: put out all the emails; run the web-sites; and run the Christian Radio stations, don’t understand how the system works and so unwittingly continue to spread flawed advice, then we’ll miss the opportunity to be better salt and light to the nation. But the response to date has been underwhelming: please pray that their eyes will be opened.
c) to achieve a) and b) we must number every box Above The Line (OK we can leave out the Bad Parties); and,
would be better
c) to achieve a) and b) we must number every box Above The Line (OK we could leave out the Bad Parties, but that gives crooked counters, who do exist, the opportunity to invalidate your vote by pencilling in a second or third #1 in a box you left blank)
Re Silvana Nero, it’s not one anonymous comment. I included that link because I didn’t wan to go into that story again but every politically aware Christian in NSW knows about it. A brother I trust has told me some of Fred’s children even refuse to vote for Silvana.
Nothing against Fred. I have said he should retire before the next election and hand hi seat to Paul Green, but if he’s on the ballot again I’m voting for him. But appreciating what he’s done for 30-40 years doesn’t mean I have to vote to put Silvana in the Senate when there are so many doubts about how she’s moved in on the Nile family.
Trying to look for the less bad major party is like trying to work out who is the less evil of Hitler, Stalin or Mussolini. Yeah, it’s gotta be Mussolini but would you vote for him?
So NO to ATL voting, and I’m still looking for BTL candidates for my 7-12 preferences. I looked at the NSW ballot paper again and we don’t have any Libs like Alex Antric, so I still can’t find another 6 people to prayerfully give preferences too.
Michael, BTL is OK if done well. However, there are many candidates far better than Mussolini. But if you find and vote for only 12 Candidates that you are willing to support, then there is high likelihood that your vote will exhaust and have no say over the last one or two Senators. Don’t you want to at least try to prevent the candidates you think are abysmal from being elected? You can’t put someone last unless you put others first. So would you be happier with the end result if you also choose the 12 worst candidates, and number every box except theirs, even if you weren’t sure in what order to number the boxes from 13 to 23?
Don’t forget the Democratic Labour Party, which is running in the Senate, and in some lower house seats. We are unashamedly pro life and pro traditional marriage.
I for one am tired of the constant barrage of attacks on conservatives, as if being conservative is something to be ashamed of, unlike those nice, tolerant progressives.
Will most certainly share. I feel the same way you do.
I’d really appreciate an analysis of the smaller alternative conservative parties. I desperately want to vote to protect religious freedom, something both Libs and Labour have no interest in addressing and I suspect both will cave to the gender identity ideology and legislate against those of faith.
Lucy, Family voice updated their voting advice about Monday 6/5/19: I recommend
https://familyvoice.org.au/news/voting-in-the-senate. Also see The Christian Values Check https://www.christianvalues.org.au/index.php/checklists/current-elections.
AFA/NCC released new advice this morning, but it has problems that need fixing: namely that it’s best put a major party AFTER all the good small parties, rather than before or in the middle of the good-guys. If the good guys don’t get in, the major is not disadvantaged at all. But preferencing a major party early in your preferences is very likely to significantly weaken your support for small good parties, because part of your vote is wasted supporting the first 2 Major party candidates who probably don’t need your support.
A good way to “analys(e) the smaller alternative conservative parties” is to check their How To Vote recommendations – the good-guys tend to recommend the other good guys, and similarly the bad-guys. I’m desperately trying to finish such an analysis for all States, but so far only NSW and VIC are online at tinyurl.com/ElectoralReformOz – look for the HTVFlag items, and you can see that the good and bad guys cluster together.
Dear Ross & Lucy,
Even our “Christian” Prime Minister has abandoned Israel Folau during the election.
Thanks for the recommendation Ross. I have added the DLP candidates to my list of how I am going to vote BTL:
 Annie Wright. (CDP GROUP P #2)
 Sophie York (Australian Conservatives GROUP M #1)
 Riccardo Bosi (Australian Conservatives GROUP M #2)
 Maree Nichols (Rise Up Australia GROUP A #1)
 Vladimir Shigrov (Rise Up Australia GROUP A #2)
 Leon Toop (Rise Up Australia GROUP A #3)
 General Jim Molan (Liberal & Nationals GROUP D #4)
 Daniel Hanna (Democratic Labour Party GROUP AA #1)
 Benedict O’Brien (Democratic Labour Party GROUP AA #2)
I am still looking for 3 more good candidates to get to 12 BTL if anyone has any suggestions.
Michael, I have no specific recommendations here, but have you checked out individual candidates in Groups H (Shooters etc), O (Fraser Anning), S (P.Hanson), X (Better Families) & AI (Small Business)? I understand that Anning himself is Christian, don’t know about his candidates, but his HTVs Australia wide tend to include Christians at least in his first 6, so suss out the individuals. Similarly, all the other groups listed are not unfriendly to Christian parties, including them in their 6. Sadly Jim Molan has an ‘unwinnable’ position, and probably also Annie Wright. Jim should get the message and move to AC, CDP, DLP or RUAP.
Now hopefully, and perhaps realistically, Sophie York could take seat-6. That will be great! But if not, or even if she does very well and takes seat-5, then, sadly, unless one of your remaining 11 beats the odds and remains in the race for the 6th seat, your vote will be useless in helping to keep Animal Justice, Socialists, Labor or Greens from getting the last seat and causing havoc opposing Sophie & other Christian colleagues in the Senate .
Michael, please consider working backwards from 105 through the candidates of the worst twelve Parties, and then ‘prayerfully select’ (guess or follow the Traditional Family Values Guide) to complete the remaining middle. You do not need to bother numbering any Candidate below #3 for Labor or Liberal; or below #2 for Green, or below #1 for anyone else, because those candidates have ‘un-winnable’ positions. But caution: then you need to start backwards from a number less than 105 and make sure you don’t miss any numbers.
So if you want me and other non-European Christians to vote for Fraser Anning’s National Liberal Party can you please explain what place people like me, a Maronite Catholic Lebanese-Australian Christian, or Sri Lankan-Australian Christians, or Australian Chinese Christians will have in Anning’s vision of a “predominantly European Christian Commonwealth” of Australia?
Yes we want a predominantly Christian immigration program, but not just a European Christian immigration program. And I hope Australia’s Christians stand for all Christians nut just the white ones, and don’t vote for Fraser Anning’s party.
Dear Michael, a good WASP Aussie friend of mine with an Asian wife of many years emailed me to complain that he knew Fraser Anning from his church , and I should rate him higher than he was rated in a draft. Before that, I knew of Fraser Anning only via our media – which can be relied upon to unswervingly discredit Christians whenever and wherever they can, whenever they can spin a story. Also, what is YOUR understanding of “predominantly European Christian Commonwealth”? Correct me if I’m wrong but it seems that you understand it to mean “as close to White Australia Policy as we can get”. But is that what Fraser Anning means by those four words quoted? Ask him! Is he correctly reported in context? If you don’t ask, you risk building/maintaining a wall of prejudice based on misinformation. What if those words mean, to Fraser, “a predominantly Judeo/Christian CULTURE Commonwealth of Australia where migrants who are willing to share in that culture are welcome”? I can’t answer that because I don’t know the man. My friend does know him. The way his Party preferences other Parties around Australia, indicates to me that he is an ally of Judeo Christian ethics – which ethics are not, and never were, racist in the modern sense (yes they did abhor Baal and Molech worshipping nations etc., but foreigners such as Ruth was from the hated Moabites, but she integrated into Israel’s culture to become David’s grandmother and she is by no means the only one). So please ask him, and let us know his response. It’s important to you, and to us.
I would love a candidate who stood for a “a predominantly Judeo/Christian CULTURE Commonwealth of Australia where migrants who are willing to share in that culture are welcome” but Mr Anning by his own words stands for a “predominantly European Christian Commonwealth”.
His words, not mine.
This is totally un-Christian to me. Jesus was not a European man. A country that would exclude Jesus is not a Christian country.
His Party’s approach to white centerdness and race worries me. A WASP with an Asian wife isn’t a guarantee there’s no racism there. Asians apparently aren’t as “threatening” to WASP’s as people like my father, my brothers and me who are Maronites who migrated from Lebanon during the Civil War (1975-1990) and Asian women are seen as desirable by many WASP men because they’re better if you’re looking for a more traditional wife than all those white women who are influenced by the feminist culture.
Michael, that sounds like reverse racism to me. I know plenty of people who value our predominantly European Christian Commonwealth culture and ethics and have are good friends with people of other backgrounds and cultures who have come to Australia or been born here of migrant parents who came because of our freedoms (under threat though they may be if we don’t keep out Labor & Greens, by numbering every box ;-)). You still haven’t explored the wider context of what Fraser Anning means – you fixate on two words “predominantly European” and build walls around that. Perhaps he does mean what you fear, but I suspect he means he values our culture and doesn’t want it changed by refugees from economic or strife situations who want to change Australia to be more like the poor and strife-riven regions from whence they came. Please do not carry on ‘hating’ on Fraser Anning unless you have actually checked his opinion, not the media’s spin on it. Send him an email and ask! And please, do us all a favour and number every box to help keep out Labor and the Greens.
If “he values our culture and doesn’t want it changed by refugees from economic or strife situations who want to change Australia to be more like the poor and strife-riven regions from whence they came” then Fraser Anning should say that.
That man chooses his words and I judge him on his words. If he wants to be judged differently, he should choose different words. I shouldn’t have to email him to ask if he really means what he said.
You guys should start understanding ethnic Australians are Australia’s Christian future. Without the Maronites, Coptics and Caldeans, and the Chinese and other Asian Christians, no seat in any major city would have voted NO in the marriage plebiscite. We’re not the cucks here.
And I’m still looking for BTL candidates to get up to 12. Any ideas?
Michael, try tinyurl.com/y34vdrwr. It is VERY easy to follow that Guide. Simply go there on your mobile, open your State, put the phone flat (so it can’t auto-rotate) zoom in, move the image to the left and you can easily copy the numbers onto your ballot paper.
OK, I know, sorry, it’s only ATL, but I beg you Michael, I can almost guarantee that you will achieve what’s in your heart better that way than by your proposed 1-12 BTL vote. Your BTL proposal risks doing absolutely nothing to stop Anning, or a totally anti-Christian anti-family candidate winning the 5th or 6th seats in NSW. Don’t you want to prevent that?
If that tinyurl link above has Anning where you don’t want him, please use tinyurl.com/ElectionReformOz, and find page 2 of the NSW How To Vote Guide to help you write your own ATL voting order. That link also contains the other link, since the Senate recommendations in both links are IDENTICAL. The content of the first link above was done by Sharon Cousins in Woolongong NSW, using my Senate recommendations.