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Bill Muehlenberg's commentary on issues of the day...

Banning “Conversion Therapy” and the War on Choice

Nov 23, 2019

Rainbow warrior militants and coercive states are banning help for homosexuals:

Various places around the West are denying genuine choice to those who may most need it. I refer to bans on help and counsel for those who are not happy with their same-sex attractions. Many governments today are so utterly in the iron grip of the homosexual activists that they are actually outlawing those who want to make such help available.

In some places if you even dare to pray for such a person you might run afoul of the law. Imagine that! Just decades ago many groups – secular and religious – existed to help such people, because most folks knew this was an unwanted and abnormal lifestyle.

But now governments are teaming up with the militants to crack down on those offering counselling and therapy. Now the ones on the outer are those who actually believe heterosexuality is the norm, and that those struggling should be able to get help in these areas. How things have changed in such a short period of time.

I mention all this because there is a very troubling “discussion” paper which the dastardly Andrews’ Labor government in Victoria has put out on this matter. It pretends to want community input on the matter, but that is not so – it has already made up its mind on where it wants to go on this. The hyper-left Labor government want all such help banned. d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/acl/pages/10985/attachments/original/1573713596/Conversion_Practices_Discussion_Paper_%286%29.pdf?1573713596

And of course they have been speaking to and running with mainly only select groups: the homosexual lobby, the activists and their supporters. They are not in the slightest interested in what ordinary Victorians think about this. So the whole thing is really just a façade and a game.

The government does not really want to hear from you. Only the homosexual militants will get a fair hearing. Yet in times like this we gotta play the game anyway, so I did in fact put in a brief submission. I expect it to be duly ignored. For what it is worth, what follows is my submission on this issue:

*****

The discussion paper on ‘Conversion therapy’ is hugely problematic for so many reasons, and we hope that no legislation based on it will be forthcoming. First, the term itself is a loaded and pejorative term, used by those who do not want homosexually-attracted persons to get the help they are looking for. Thus this discussion paper is biased from the very start.

What in fact is now being offered is simply counselling, or perhaps, as some put it, reparative therapy. It exists for those who want it. But no ‘conversion’ is going on here – certainly no one is forcing anybody to convert to anything. It is simply about offering real help and counsel for those who desperately want such help.

If the government is genuinely concerned about hearing from people in the community on this – all people – it certainly should allow ex-homosexuals a clear chance to share their stories, instead of just catering to militant homosexual activist groups. A “discussion” in which only one side of the debate is routinely and consistently run with is no discussion at all, but merely a foregone conclusion.

Indeed, the very first sentence in the paper makes it clear that the government has already made up its mind: “The purpose of this discussion paper is to seek the community’s views on the best way/s to implement a ban of conversion practices.”

Um, why not ask the people if they even want such a ban, instead of cramming it down the throats of all Victorians as a foregone conclusion? So much for genuine discussion and debate! This is simply more top-down coercive social engineering from the Andrews’ government.

And numerous questions arise with this discussion paper, such as:

Questions about choice

-Why does this government believe that choice is paramount in so many other areas, eg., the right of a woman to choose to kill her own baby in her womb, or the right of kids to choose to change their sex simply because they feel like it, but not here?
-Why are those who are unhappy with their same-sex attractions and want help and counsel being denied that same sort of choice by this government?
-Why does this government want to trap people in unwanted conditions and deny them the help and possible therapy they so very much want?
-Please tell us why this government seems hellbent on taking away choice for those who desperately want choice in this area.

Questions about sexuality

-Why does this government insist that a homosexual is born the way he is and can never change, even though there are countless ex-homosexuals who exist who give lie to this myth?
-Why does this government also insist at the same time (through its promotion of the harmful “Safe” Schools programs, etc), that people can be born male or female, yet their natal sex is fluid and simply a social construct that can be changed at will – even by children?
-Why is one aspect of human sexuality totally immutable and unchangeable, yet this other area of human sexuality totally mutable and changeable?
-Why all the obvious contradictions and double standards here?
-Why does this government seem more intent on running with radical political ideology than with science, biology and reality?

Questions about freedom

-Why this war on freedom – religious freedom, freedom of conscience, and the rights of self-determination, to name but a few basic freedoms?
-Why is this government wanting to harass and go after those who offer real help and support to those who very much want and need such help?
-Why this determined effort to destroy wonderful and proven counselling works and services, just to fit in a radical activist agenda?
-Will the Andrews’ government soon outlaw all related counsel, sermons, pastoral work and even prayer as it pushes radical secular left policies that are hostile to religion, to family, and to freedom?

Yes, homosexuals can change if they want to

The main premise of this discussion paper is the myth that homosexuals cannot change. This is simply not true. Many have left the homosexual lifestyle and gone on to heterosexual marriage and family. I know many such people personally. Why does this government pretend they do not exist? Why are they the new invisible people?

And non-religious groups are also involved in offering such help and assistance. The decidedly non-religious Masters and Johnson Clinic in St. Louis for example has treated hundreds of homosexuals and bisexuals. Masters reports that they have successfully “changed” more than half of their homosexual clients, and higher than 75 per cent of bisexuals.

One New York University psychologist, Dr. Robert Kronemeyer, puts it this way: “With rare exceptions, homosexuality is neither inherited nor the result of some glandular disturbance or the scrambling of genes or chromosomes. Homosexuals are made, not born that way. From my twenty-five years’ experience as a clinical psychologist, I firmly believe that homosexuality is a learned response to early painful experiences and that it can be unlearned.”

And the idea of a gay gene must be rejected. For example, arch-atheist Richard Dawkins put it this way: “Whether you hate homosexuals or whether you love them, whether you want to lock them up or ‘cure’ them, your reasons had better have nothing to do with genes. Rather admit to prejudiced emotion than speciously drag genes in where they do not belong.”

One Australian homosexual activist has said similar things about homosexuality and genetics: “I think the idea that sexuality is genetic is crap. There is absolutely no evidence for it at the moment, and I think it is unhealthy that people want to embrace this idea. It does reflect a desire to say, ‘it’s not our fault’, as a way of deflecting our critics. We have achieved what we have achieved by defiance, not by concessions. I think we should be recruiting people to homosexuality. It’s a great lifestyle and something everybody should have the right to experience. If you believe it’s genetic, how are you going to make the effort?”

There are plenty more such quotes that could be presented here. So we must insist that this is not just a religious issue. Numerous secular groups, and even many homosexuals themselves, have spoken about how real choice is found here, and everything is NOT predetermined by genetics, or birth, and so on.

But Christians are of course interested in seeing lives set free from unwanted addictions and behaviours. So Christians will especially be targeted by any such laws here. As one English doctor puts it: “Taking therapy for unwanted same-sex attraction can include two goals, depending on what the client wants: some people want to diminish their same-sex attraction and remain celibate; others also wish to see a development in their natural potential for opposite-sex attraction. As this work is likely more common among Christians, the campaign to ban such therapy has anti-Christian and anti-social implications that reach well beyond this kind of pastoral care.”

Conclusion

The questions and points offered above – and more could be raised – show the very real dangers and harms that any such legislation would have. We call upon the government to scrap this initiative immediately. We want no such laws put in place.

Those people looking for help should be able to get it. And those people who are offering such help should be able to offer it, and not fear being shut down or fined or punished in some other way by a heavy-handed government intent on pushing minority group agendas instead of offering real choice to people. All those offering this help should be allowed to do so – be they from churches or mosques or temples or non-religious counselling practices, and regardless if they are pastors or imams or priests or rabbis or secular counsellors, etc.

(Note: Most of the documentation for what is presented above can be found in my 2011 book Strained Relations which has over 700 endnotes.)

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19 Responses to Banning “Conversion Therapy” and the War on Choice

  • Homosexuality is a mental illness and should be treated as such. More than half of homosexuals were abused as children and around half of homosexuals are in fact bisexual. The homosexual movement is self deception as a group effort.

  • You’re right about our opinions being ignored, Bill. As with every other submission we have been asked to make in the past four or so years, what the radicals want will be what we will get. I wonder if the Victorian government asks for submissions so it can list those who object with a view of keeping an eye on them in coming years and with coming issues, seeing it so blatantly overrides and ignores our concerns. However, if as is happening to Christians in China now, one day in the future Christians in Australia are persecuted, we will have to cling to Jesus’ promises: that He will never leave or forsake us, that we will not be given more than we can bear without a way of escape (even if that is death), and that what we suffer here on earth is not worth thinking about compared to what we will be rewarded with in heaven. It’s hard to be positive in the face of such injustice as we see happening to faithful Christians around the world. And a final thought: how can the gay brigade know who is praying for them & when? Are they into mind reading?

  • Very well done Bill.
    Why are so many Victorians willing to live under a gaystapo dictatorship?
    How is this even legal?

  • #VictoriaTheStateOfDenial in decay and corruption and they still voted for the cause and the corruption…

  • Good on you Bill!
    A really well written submission, but as you say, sadly lost on Daniel the Destroyer as he is beholden to the most evil of the Left and has little interest in the welfare of children or decency.
    As you point out, his stance is completely hypocritical and often irreparably damaging to suffering children and adults. His ironically named “Safe Schools” program has been a catalyst for the increasing numbers of distressed and damaged children.
    It is intentional, severe child abuse in the extreme; if only someone could hold these creeps to account! Our politicians and Prime Minister seem bereft of any moral principles in this area.
    We can only continue to speak our piece and hope the penny drops- eventually.
    Please keep up the great work you do.

  • Sadly Dan, enemy/slayer of precious freedom, has so many sheeple voters duped.

  • Jesus Christ came to heal the broken hearted and to set the captives free. Homosexuals and bisexuals and transgenders are sure in this category. Jesus was tempted in all things yet without sin. The Bible scriptures say that he healed all sicknesses and all diseases and that includes homosexuality.
    Romans 1 lists all of the sins and homosexuality, and bi sexuality are in there. God wants to help a person get out of sin. Jesus healed all diseases and sicknesses and then he said to the sinnners go and sin no more. GOD and Jesus Christ love the person but they do not love the sin. Churches today are not helping people get out of sinning but are patting them on the back and saying you go ahead and sin against God its okay.
    The homosexuals that arelooking to get out of this thing that is destroying them are not being allowed to go get counseling to help themselves.
    Satan wants to steal their godly lives and anything that could bring glory to God. Satan does not want them to change so that they are a glory to God. God can change anyone’s heart and lifestyle to love Him and to embrace a normal life style of man and woman and to reflect that Christ within!

  • There is only one thing wrong with this submission. You did not allow the many thousands of people who would like to have said this to add their signature. Is there some way perhaps the ACL or some other group could arrange this?

  • Thanks Michael. Although those who conduct government inquiries tend to prefer personal letters over any sort of petitions or form letters. So individuals writing things in their own words tend to get the most traction with those running these inquiries.

  • From one who loves to play with words, I find it interesting that, by jumbling the letters of DANIEL, we get DENIAL! And what greater contrast between the Daniel of scripture – whose wisdom and integrity were unsurpassed – and Daniel Andrews, who makes a mockery of all that is of God. This reminds me of the famous writing on the wall during the reign of King Belshazzar: “MENE MENE TEKEL PARSIN” – and the interpretation of those words that God gave Daniel. It may seem to us right now that Victoria will never have a righteous and Godly leader, and yet we, the people of Victoria, voted this man into power – repeatedly! Of course, he is ultimately answerable to God, who has His own agenda in all this. He alone can raise people up and remove them from leadership according to His purposes. And let’s face it, the State Opposition has been abysmally weak for the past few years. And so we must pray that, through all this, God’s purposes will be carried out.

  • Has anyone ever noticed how all the testimonies are the same?? Different people same words. Or that no one ever bothers to investigate the names of the councilors or clinics or camps named during testimony??? It’s almost like they know it’s a script and if they check into it the whole thing will be exposed!

    Then you have Christians who are “allies” buying into the whole “God made me this way” shtick. Others say we should just bring them to Christ and not worry about anything else after all we all sin and Jesus washed us all clean. And the ever popular “God is love” !

  • Thanks guys. And new resistance to this tyranny is arising with groups standing up for those wanting help for their unwanted same-sex attractions: https://billmuehlenberg.com/2019/11/24/resistance-fighters-taking-on-the-evil-empire/

  • Thank you for this article. I just made a (last minute) submission to the government.

  • This all seems rather confusing. The Left insists we embrace folk based on the gender they claim to be not the gender they actually are. Now the Left want to ban services based not on what they are, but based on what they claim they are. How can people who live in reality function in a society where the rules are made by people who live in unreality? How can you be sure whether any particular act or speech is permitted or prohibited when the determination will be made by people fully disconnected from reality and whose definitions are fluid and amorphous? It sounds like one part 1984, one part pure anti-Christianity.

  • Section 116 of the Commonwealth of Australia Constitution Act 1900 (UK) forbids the Commonwealth and the States from making any law that prohibits the free exercise and observance of religion. Thus. any law that prohibits prayer would offend the provisions of section 116.

    For those who may argue that section 116 only prohibits the Commonwealth power and not the States, section 106 compels the States to bow to the Commonwealth Constitution at section 106 which creates the States (subject to this constitution).

    John Abbott

  • It is sad that the word “gay” has been hijacked by an agenda driven group. There is nothing “gay” about homosexuality! See http://www.insectman.us/misc/gay-is-sad.htm

    Gay is SAD. http://insectman.us/misc/gay-is-sad.htm

  • A cursory glance at the government discussion paper shows the term “conversion therapy” is now regarded as undesirable and has been replaced with the term “conversion practices”. The rewriting of language and the radical alteration of the semantic fields covered by words and phrases is, doubtless, an integral part of the “shameless revolution” that is underway right under our noses…

    Ultimately, “conversion practices” is a phrase which lends itself admirably to extension into anti-discrimination laws that deal with acceptable and unacceptable practices in the realm of religious beliefs: Could we soon be seeing a situation where it will become an illegal violation of social justice and communal harmony for individuals to voluntarily convert from one religion to another?

    There already exist jurisdictions beyond Australia where “freedom of religion” is more about freedom to keep the religion of one’s upbringing – where the freedom to voluntarily convert to another religion is seen as unnecessary and as posing a dangerous threat to communal harmony and national identity.

    Moreover, the assumption that all faiths are equal is surely in direct opposition to the assertion that we are all sinners in need of a radical, God-driven change of life known as “conversion”.

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